Posts by Anders Andersen

27

Contradictions!

by Freedom rocks in

quite regularly at meetings jws mocked worldly people and apostates(anyone who had left the "truth") for saying the bible contradicts itself when it is in complete harmony from beginning to end apparently.

can anyone point out some of the contradictions they know of?

they used to laugh at the fact people on the doors would say the bible contradicts itself and when they asked the householder to show them where, they couldn't..

Anders Andersen

Another list of 531 contradictions in the Bible: http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/number.html

remark of the author of that website:

I've never seen a contradiction that believers can't resolve, at least to their own satisfaction. It could have been this way, it could have been that. That's what it says, but that's not what it means. It was a copyist's error. Whatever.
Contradictions are, in my opinion, the least of the Bible's problems. I include them for just one purpose: it shows that the Bible, whatever else it may be, is not inerrant.

27

Contradictions!

by Freedom rocks in

quite regularly at meetings jws mocked worldly people and apostates(anyone who had left the "truth") for saying the bible contradicts itself when it is in complete harmony from beginning to end apparently.

can anyone point out some of the contradictions they know of?

they used to laugh at the fact people on the doors would say the bible contradicts itself and when they asked the householder to show them where, they couldn't..

Anders Andersen

A great resource for this is http://bibviz.com/

Just hover over any of the red arcs, and a popup in the corner will show the topic and Bible verses.

Or click on one of the red lines, and you'll end up on a details page.

Note: sometimes the verse numbers and quotes are a bit off. So if the quoted verse don't make the contradiction clear, look them up and read the context as well.

85

Newspaper reports: Dutch government will initiate inquiry into child abuse within JW community

by Anders Andersen in

today a dutch newspaper published an in-depth follow-up item on jw abuse issues.. the most interesting part of the article is this:.

the politicians also let themselves be heard.

a month ago the house of representatives voted unanimously in favor of a motion to enforce an independent inquiry into abuse within the jehovah's witnesses, as the organization refuses to initiate it.

Anders Andersen

RC needs to have their already dubious claims scrutinized

If I recall correctly, Reclaimed Voices petitioned the JW to cooperate in an investigation of these report.

JW refused.

RV then the petitioned the government to put the spotlight on their claims. The government asked JW to investigate.

JW refused.

RV really wants their claims scrutinized.

The only ones who want to avoid any investigation are the JW.

85

Newspaper reports: Dutch government will initiate inquiry into child abuse within JW community

by Anders Andersen in

today a dutch newspaper published an in-depth follow-up item on jw abuse issues.. the most interesting part of the article is this:.

the politicians also let themselves be heard.

a month ago the house of representatives voted unanimously in favor of a motion to enforce an independent inquiry into abuse within the jehovah's witnesses, as the organization refuses to initiate it.

Anders Andersen

Today a Dutch newspaper published an in-depth follow-up item on JW abuse issues.

The most interesting part of the article is this:

The politicians also let themselves be heard. A month ago the House of Representatives voted unanimously in favor of a motion to enforce an independent inquiry into abuse within the Jehovah's Witnesses, as the organization refuses to initiate it. Minister Sander Dekker of legal protection can't do anything other than comply, said spokesperson when asked. In autumn, more will be made known about the how and what.

So the newspaper called the Minister of Legal Protection, asked whether he will or will not start an inquiry as the MPs demand, and the Minister's spokesperson said 'he can't do anything other than comply'.

Stay tuned folks! The indian summer will be very hot for the Dutch branch!

8

JW's really are NOT really neutral in politics - Proof

by LevelThePlayingField in

from: https://www.jw.org/en/news/legal/legal-resources/information/.

(emphasis is mine).

“jehovah’s witnesses do not involve themselves in political issues or governmental affairs.

Anders Andersen

Oh I forgot to mention that in these meetings also other evangelical churches, the Vatican, Scientology and Muslim sects participate.

Double the fun, double the hypocrisy.

8

JW's really are NOT really neutral in politics - Proof

by LevelThePlayingField in

from: https://www.jw.org/en/news/legal/legal-resources/information/.

(emphasis is mine).

“jehovah’s witnesses do not involve themselves in political issues or governmental affairs.

Anders Andersen

For those who don't know, the JW org is still actively involved with the OSCE.

They can try to reason away the UN thing as a library card mistake made by a single bro.

But their OSCE actions involve Marcel Gillet, one of JW top dogs in Europe.

Somehow many exjw don't know about JW and OSCE, but to me it's a very much more damning and hypocritical involvement with 'worldly governments'. At least it's not often discussed, while this OSCE stuff is very recent (they participated in meetings in 2017).

10

How could I get a copy of the elders secret book?

by purrpurr in

the shepherding the flock one?

i'd love to read it and get the inside track of how the elders are meant to work.

anyone got a pdf?

Anders Andersen

@zebra, there is a more public and ironic case of that.

In Finland JW had to hand over the elders manual to the Minister of Justice and the Minister of Interior....both women. The newspapers reported on it too, making it all too public.

Jehovah's Witnesses will hand over their secret rule book to the Minister of Justice, Anna-Maja Henriksson, and the Minister of the Interior, Päivi Räsänen.

https://yle.fi/uutiset/osasto/news/jehovahs_witnesses_to_hand_over_top_secret_manual/7244267

How painful to have women demand you hand over your secret elders book., and JW have to comply.... Lol

10

How could I get a copy of the elders secret book?

by purrpurr in

the shepherding the flock one?

i'd love to read it and get the inside track of how the elders are meant to work.

anyone got a pdf?

Anders Andersen

There are several sites that have it. I know jw-wayback.org

If you go that site you can also get all the BOE letters and such.

There you go:

http://www.watchtowerwayback.org/jw-wb/English/Internal%20Documents/Elders/ELDERS%20BOOK%202010-2012%20Shepherd%20the%20flock%20of%20God%20(ks10-E).pdf

17

Do Circuit Overseers outrank Elders? Why can't they talk to disfellowshipped people?

by garyneal in

jw
friends

last sunday, our family went to the kingdom hall and i realized that this was the week that the circuit overseer was in town.

when we sat down, i noticed he came over and talked to her then he walked away i guess to talk to others.

a few minutes later, he returned to tell her that he could not talk to her because he was informed that she was disfelloshipped.

Anders Andersen

wt 15 4/15 p. 31 - "For the sake of reminding disfellowshipped ones of how they can return to Jehovah, elders may periodically visit those who have given some evidence of changing their ways."

Yes. The elders manual clearly states that this should be done following these rules:

Only once a year
List of persons to visit will be decided on by the body of elders
Two elders will be authorized to visit the DFed.

Of course these details aren't stated in the WT lest regular Joe Publisher find out how legalistic this 'loving' arrangement actually is.

17

Do Circuit Overseers outrank Elders? Why can't they talk to disfellowshipped people?

by garyneal in

jw
friends

last sunday, our family went to the kingdom hall and i realized that this was the week that the circuit overseer was in town.

when we sat down, i noticed he came over and talked to her then he walked away i guess to talk to others.

a few minutes later, he returned to tell her that he could not talk to her because he was informed that she was disfelloshipped.

Anders Andersen

Not even elders are allowed speak to (make small talk with) DFed persons.

Only elders who are authorized by the whole body of elders may speak to DFed persons once a year to see if they want to return (to their vomit).

And for those DFed who visit meetings, elders aren't allowed to talk to them unless it's necessary for their reinstatement or if the person needs to have some arrangement for transport to meetings.

So the CO just did as he and other elders are supposed to do: no make small talk with DFed people.

By quickly stopping to speak to the DFed, the CO also gave a strong signal to elders: Follow the rules! Shun! I listened to this minor thing you brought to my attention, and in reciprocation you should obey my every word!

Him coming back to say 'sorry, wont talk to you no mo' is probably his last shred of human decency combined with the desire to let the DFed know they are being punished because they're DFed. He prefers to be a shunning asshole over being mistaken for an asshole who forgets about a conversation and doesn't return to it.